sembei wrote:Birds also in Mantegna, but i suppose those are pigeons or sparrows.
By the way, the upper side of this card remembers me the "air" card of minchiates. :-l
It can't be our Lady naked, pouring water. It is just not something you do on a Christian society like Europe on XVII century.
Catholic wrote: I really loved Steve's Stella Matutina, as I like any connection that hints that Tarot has European Catholic and Renascence roots. This would be a noble and ancient enough origin and one that, I think, has the maximum explicative power. But this is a personal preference.
Catholic wrote:I think I was a little rude. Sorry Pen. Its is hard to argue on another language.
I think other decks actually used some of the theories. I definitely saw cards with "Astronomer-Generic Stars", Aquarius, "Wise Man/ Star of Bethlehem", Venus etc. And I agree with Michael Hurst (by the way, great article, thanks) that there is no single unifying symbolism on Tarot. Any Star related theme would fit the bill for a creative card maker. But there is a single unifying symbolism on Tarot de Marseille. Quoting Michael Hurst, "Tarot de Marseille’s other stuff, a woman pouring two vessels into a stream, with a bird and bushes in the background, is just obscure.". This is the bug that bitten me.
Catholic wrote:My particular interest is not discover the hidden mystic origins of the Tarot, but make heads and tails of what Jean Noblet, Jean Dodal and Nicolas Conver had in their minds.
...Jean Noblet, maitre-cartier (master cardmaker), living at Saint Germaine-des Prés, rue Sainte Marguerite, paroisse (parish) Sainte Suplice in Paris. D'Allegmagne indicated that that Noblet's name is to be found on a list of cardmakers in 1664...
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