Boudet "Entre science et nigromance"

Tarot History related Books and Articles.

Re: Boudet "Entre science et nigromance"

Postby marco on 25 May 2009, 08:54

Hello Robert,
thank you for investigating about this book.
Do you think you will be able to share a few pages?

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Re: Boudet "Entre science et nigromance"

Postby robert on 25 May 2009, 11:29

here are the 5 pages that I copied that had "sorts" on them (according to the index):









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Re: Boudet "Entre science et nigromance"

Postby prudence on 25 May 2009, 15:38

my french is god awful, but I can see right away that page 249 has some gems! I do not know what a hostie is, but one of the lines says something about putting the blood of a man or a woman on a "hostie" or some other object.... (of course my mind thinks is that a cake?? lol, a la Hostess cupcakes) All of those lines say something interesting...#8 says something about intestines of an animal and or the hands of a man, must be about trying to divine using those things...There seems to be a lot of stuff about observing the seasons, the month, the day....

It's great that you can enlarge the pages, Robert. I will wait for someone fluent to come along and translate it though.
"...he wanted to illustrate with his figures many Moral teachings, and under some difficulty, to bite into bad and dangerous customs, & show how today many Actions are done without goodness and honesty, and are accomplished in ways that are contrary to duty and rightfulness."
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Re: Boudet "Entre science et nigromance"

Postby robert on 25 May 2009, 16:55

yes, I hope someone who can understand it will jump in and give us a gist of what is being discussed here. I, sadly, haven't a clue. ~x(
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Re: Boudet "Entre science et nigromance"

Postby marco on 25 May 2009, 17:31

Thank you Robert.
These pages look interesting, even if I already knew some of their content, having an interest in "Lot Books" (originating from Marcolini).


At the very beginning of the first page (94) there is an interesting annotation on how, in the XIII Century, Necromancy (divination through talking with the dead) started to be interpreted as Nigromancy (black divination, requiring the intervention of the Devil).
Page 95 is about Lot Books, Fortune Telling books (different forms of Bibliomancy).
Page 112 is about Spatulomantia (divination by means of some sheep bones, I think)
Page 113 about more Fortune Telling books
Page 154. 155 are about Ars Notoria (I don't know what this is)
Page 248 describes how the Inquisition begun to have an interest in divination, and this is documented by means of a "manual" detailing the questions to be asked by the inquisitors
Page 558 has the same text as 248 in its original Latin form
Page 559 Index of the Clavicula Salomonis in a Latin and an Italian version

At page 113 there is a reference to a Book of Judgements and Counsels (Liber judiciorum et consiliorum) that was written in the XII Century. The text was originally Arabic and was translated into Latin by Gerard de Cremone.
It was "very sophisticated and functioned in the following way: all questions were associated to star or to a group of stars. They were distributed into twelve lists, which were ordered according to the signs of the Zodiac. So there was a total of 144 questions and 1728 answers (144x12)". Cool :)

The figure at page 154 is also completely new to me. There are groups of swords and staffs that are similar to playing cards, but the figure is older (XIII Century).

At least one version of the Clavicula Salomonis (page 559) is available online:
http://www.esotericarchives.com/solomon/lemegeton.htm

Prudence, I guess that Hostie means "Host" (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/host%5B5%5D)

The book seems to be well documented.

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Re: Boudet "Entre science et nigromance"

Postby marco on 25 May 2009, 17:38

A translation of the Summary, from one of the pages posted by Ross:
http://www.priceminister.com/offer/buy/ ... .html#info

THE CLASH OF THE TRANSLATIONS AND THE SEARCH FOR A STANDARD (XII AND XIII CENTURIES)
# The revival of the science of the stars (twelfth-thirteenth century)
# Divination and Divinatory Arts in the twelfth and thirteenth centuries
# Magic and its transformations in the XII - XIII centuries
# The social demand and the impulse from the Courts (XII - XII centuries)
# The search for theological and legal rules in the twelfth and thirteenth centuries: adjustments, contradictions, convictions

# DEVELOPMENT, PROLIFERATION AND REPRESSION (XIV AND XV CENTURIES)
# The promotion of social and political astrology
# Learned Magic and its dissemination in the fourteenth and fifteenth centuries
# The genesis of the medieval witch-hunt
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Re: Boudet "Entre science et nigromance"

Postby Ross G. R. Caldwell on 25 May 2009, 19:57

Thanks very much for posting these pages Robert, and for summarizing it Marco. The book is everything it should be - fully documented, well-written, never leaving the reader asking "where did you get that idea from?". It looks like I should have it.

I'm not sure what to do with it besides what Marco has done in summarizing the pages shown - shall we discuss the Sorts of the Apostles, or try to interpret the diagram further?

Spatulomancy is divination by the shoulder-blades - I'm not sure whether they are cooked/roasted or not, but I assume so. So the reading is by the cracks and maybe other features on the bone, like colors or lumps.

It does interest me that the Inquisition so quickly became interested in divination, because of its implied idolatry.

Some of the "suspicious activities" seem pretty strict, and I can't imagine them being enforced - because they are still done today - (Ask him...)
"10. If he has done something for good fortune at the moment of the first of January, exchanging gifts for the occasion" (the phrase "for the étrennes" is the name of the ancient custom of giving gifts at midnight of the New Year).

I'll look at some more and translate the relevant paragraphs.

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Re: Boudet "Entre science et nigromance"

Postby robert on 25 May 2009, 20:09

Thanks Marco and Ross for sharing your general idea of the pages with us and your impression of the quality of the text.

much appreciated. :-bd
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Re: Boudet "Entre science et nigromance"

Postby robert on 25 May 2009, 21:12

I also photocopied the plates in the back of the book. There were other pages as well in the body of the text that had some illustrations, but I only had time to get these.

Big files, poor quality, but hopefully those who are interested can make something out from them considering that they are jpgs of scans of photocopies!.

















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Re: Boudet "Entre science et nigromance"

Postby marco on 26 May 2009, 19:33

Thank you for the images Robert. I think they are all new to me. I think that Planche XV is particularly unusual.

I was very impressed by the description of the illuminated page at Planche XI. The author wrote that the figure "represents the figure of the sky in the moment of the creation of the World, with the signs of the Zodiac and the planets, their houses and their places, according to the opinion the astrologers and the theologians . Secondly there are painted different things that represent the meaning on earth and in the lower world of the twelve imaginary houses of the sky. Thirdly, there is the painting of the map of the whole world, complete and correct, with the four main winds".
A cosmology on a single page :)

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