Re: Missale 1593

71
Huck wrote: ... .-) ... this all looks like a shop of a diamond trader
=))
Nah a Lombardy Jewish Pawnbroker/Banker/Moneylender who was never going to get to Heaven anyway. That is why he is way back in the line 8-}
Coming to the end of the game...one might say before Judgement and been raised to play again...
Render therefore to all, their dues; tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom, fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour. Owe no man anything, but love one another thus fulfilling the Law

:(|)
The Universe is full of magical things patiently waiting for our wits to grow sharper.
Eden Phillpotts

Re: Missale 1593

72
and a good question it is, which of them wouldn't be really not brilliant.
Not exactly. :)

All your pairs are pair of concepts, but not pair iconographyc. Its the same picture/2 (in this deck).

In Spanish, brilliant is used to say "a good idea". And yes, I think is a very good observation of Robert.
When a man has a theory // Can’t keep his mind on nothing else (By Ross)

Re: Missale 1593

74
Why if they can woodblock Halos around the four Apostle's symbols and around the Angel have they not put them around the figures by the grave? (if they are Mary and John)
It seems to me that the figure rising from the grave is a Jew who is now able to be resurrected, because he became Christian. That is the only explanation of the head (hat ) we are seeing from the back.
It seems to me, that we look for other examples that look nearly like what the figures are, but never quite like them for some reason or another.
Why is it that the figure in the World Card is not considered as Everyman and is thought to be Jesus instead?
Victory over death(Resurrection) makes everyone a Saint. That is what the Gospels teach.
~Lorredan
The Universe is full of magical things patiently waiting for our wits to grow sharper.
Eden Phillpotts

Re: Missale 1593

75
mmfilesi wrote:
and a good question it is, which of them wouldn't be really not brilliant.
Not exactly. :)

All your pairs are pair of concepts, but not pair iconographyc. Its the same picture/2 (in this deck).

In Spanish, brilliant is used to say "a good idea". And yes, I think is a very good observation of Robert.
Brilliant is both in English, diamond and splendid idea. ... :-) ... but too much brilliants make a diamond shop, in other words, something like seeing not the forest cause there are so many trees here ... .-)

Why are sun/moon, star-lightning, devil/temperance (as fallen angel/not fallen angel) not iconographic pairs?

Alberti for instance paired Fortune with Time, why not ... and it makes sense. Wouldn't finally not all possible combination (231 possibilities) make somehow sense?
Huck
http://trionfi.com

Re: Missale 1593

76
Why are sun/moon, star-lightning, devil/temperance (as fallen angel/not fallen angel) not iconographic pairs?
Ok... go :)

PMB:

Star - Woman pregnant
Moon - Virgin
Sun - Children and Helios

... Maybe make a conceptual trio. I just write about this:

viewtopic.php?f=12&t=598

But its sequential, as a comic. Its not the same design standard, divided by thre

Este Deck

Star - Two astrologers?????? (not astronomers) a joke with the astronomers of Medici Deck? :-??
Moon - Ptolomeo
Sun - Diogenes and Alexander

... Maybe make a conceptual trio. Only God's truth is good... I dont know. I need work this. In any case its sequential.

Medici Deck

Moon - Two astronomers
Sun - Or a moira (I think), or Eve (Robert think) or the Florentine textile industry (Huck think). In any case its sequential.

+

Marseille Family

I cant explain in English. I think it's a Neoplatonic concept relates with the rise of souls and the river of forgetfulness. But it is too complex for me in English, sorry friend.In any case its sequential.
Alberti for instance paired Fortune with Time, why not ... and it makes sense. Wouldn't finally not all possible combination (231 possibilities) make somehow sense?
I think its also a sequential concept, as triumphs of Petrarch. The time win the fame (the cariot), love and wealth (Fortuna). But not part of the same image...

Thanks for the effort to understand my English :)
When a man has a theory // Can’t keep his mind on nothing else (By Ross)

Re: Missale 1593

77
Lorredan wrote:
It's John and Mary, it's John and Mary, it's John and Mary. :-$
:D Hate to rain on your parade....That ain't no sepulcher- nor is there the greatest miracle of the rolled back stone.
If you must go this way....
Look to Mathew... Jesus, when he had cried out in a loud voice, yielded up the Spirit, and behold, A trumpet sounded and the the temple was rent from top to bottom, and the Earth shook and the rocks split and the graves were opened up and many of the Saints that slept- rose up. (best as I can remember it) O:-)

Like the Bologna origins best of all. Nah, Visconti played with a game first probably as a soldier- then got uppity and rich. :ymparty:

~Lorredan
If you look at that link I gave, there are LOTS of pictures of Christ Resurrected that show him rising from the ground rather than the stone in the mouth of a cave. Like this Fra Angelico from 1441:

or this one:
Image


This is nice:

Lots.

But I'm not pushing this anymore. I'll set it aside as a possibility, but I think that Last Judgement is more powerful. What led me back to this thread was really the mention of John and Mary, and that's what I felt when working on my card... that it was John the Baptist and Mary at the grave.

I think this image by Marcos sums it up perfectly.
Image

Re: Missale 1593

78
mmfilesi wrote:
and a good question it is, which of them wouldn't be really not brilliant.
Not exactly. :)

All your pairs are pair of concepts, but not pair iconographyc. Its the same picture/2 (in this deck).

In Spanish, brilliant is used to say "a good idea". And yes, I think is a very good observation of Robert.
I agree with you Marcos, it's different than other pairs because they have cognates in other art as a group. Now, we could say that the Bateleur and the Fool are a pair, and often they are. And you could group the Virtues. And you could group the Sun Moon Star. Fair enough. In this case, the group creates and completes a larger picture, and it is significant and in context to the theme.

And it's not my observation. Jean-Michel mentioned this years ago, as, I've no doubt, many others have as well.

Re: Missale 1593

79
Lorredan wrote:Why if they can woodblock Halos around the four Apostle's symbols and around the Angel have they not put them around the figures by the grave? (if they are Mary and John)
It seems to me that the figure rising from the grave is a Jew who is now able to be resurrected, because he became Christian. That is the only explanation of the head (hat ) we are seeing from the back.
It seems to me, that we look for other examples that look nearly like what the figures are, but never quite like them for some reason or another.
Why is it that the figure in the World Card is not considered as Everyman and is thought to be Jesus instead?
Victory over death(Resurrection) makes everyone a Saint. That is what the Gospels teach.
~Lorredan
Because I can find hundreds of contemporary images of Christ surrounded by the four evangelists. Everyman? Hmmmmm.

I agree with you about the halos, I mentioned it earlier.
cron