Re: The Telescope of Zoroaster - The Lost Documentation Found!

#1
Well, welcome ...

Do you mean this?

German text
http://www.scribd.com/doc/47608147/Zoro ... ope-German
which should have been taken from this ...
http://books.google.de/books?id=4VU5AAA ... &q&f=false
You write: "in the 1750s". The text has a date: It's "1846"
The author ...
http://de.wikisource.org/wiki/Johann_Scheible

French text (1796)
http://books.google.de/books/about/Tele ... edir_esc=y

There are easier ways to tell something than with youtube ... :-)

***********

The French text is anonymous.
There is a "Baron de N.", which signs the introduction of the French text.
Possibly there is a relation to this author:
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andr%C3%A9 ... de_Nerciat
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert-And ... de_Nerciat
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andr%C3%A9 ... de_Nerciat

see last sentence in French Wikipedia edition:
"Un grand nombre des romans signés Andrea de Nerciat sont disponibles en édition courante ou en édition de poche, certains en édition critique. Le Télescope de Zoroastre, ou Clef de la Grande Cabale divinatoire des Mages de 1796 qui lui est attribué a été réédité en 2008."

... in the German Wikipedia edition
Auf Befehl der Wiener Polizei musste Nerciat daraufhin am 24. Dezember 1796 die Stadt verlassen und begab sich nach Linz. Hier wurde er jedoch binnen weniger Tage erkannt, so dass er Österreich endgültig den Rücken kehrte und über Regensburg und Basel nach Paris zurückreiste.

Der nächste Auftrag, den er von Delacroix erhielt, führte ihn nach Mailand, wo er General Clarke unterstützen sollte, den Frieden von Campo Formio vorzubereiten. Vermutlich war diese offizielle Mission nur ein Vorwand, denn in Wahrheit sollte er den Lebenswandel von Josephine Bonaparte in Italien überwachen.

Dabei kam ihm sein italienisch klingender Namen zugute. Dieser erlaubte es ihm, sich für einen italienischen Baron auszugeben, was dieser Aufgabe sehr dienlich war. In Neapel sollte er ab Dezember 1797 als Inspektor am Hof des Königreichs von Neapel-Sizilien erneut in die Rolle eines Doppelagenten schlüpfen. So wurde er Kammerherr bei der Königin Maria Karolina von Österreich, der Königín von Neapel-Sizilien.

He worked as "secret agent". It's said, that he took the identity of an "Italian Baron" (1796/97).

This book ...
http://www.geheimeswissen.com/online-sh ... a/die.html
... gives Nerciat as author

*************

The pictures in both editions are different engravings, but more or less identical:

French version:
http://www2.biusante.parisdescartes.fr/ ... 2066&mod=s

German version (Scheible):
Image


*******************

From which source do you get the information
"In the mid 1500's an oracle appeared in Germany from an unknown source called Zoroasters Telescop "
?
Huck
http://trionfi.com

Re: The Telescope of Zoroaster - The Lost Documentation Found!

#2
There is some information on its author and provinence, in Italian and French, here:
http://www.aseq.it/telescope-de-zoroast ... -1796.html

quote:

"This kind of Tarot, which was the instrument of a prophecy about the fate of Louis XVI, consists of 112 hexagons that make up a mirror, the final destination of the proceedings cabalistic, which contribute to the formation of principles, spirits, minds and numbers.

"If in France the history of this text is merely the first and only edition, in Germany it had a different fate. The German translation appeared in 1797, was reprinted in 1846 and in 1857 by the publisher Scheible in the famous collection Das Kloster, in the twentieth century, some of its characteristics joined the ideological needs of ariosofi: in 1933 it provided the field work wahrsagende Die Kabbala der Magier : die Kabbala des Zoroaster (The Kabbalah divination of the Magi. The Kabbala of Zoroaster) Karl Kern, a German theosophist become ariosofo.

"Alexandre de Danann establishes conclusively that the author of the telescope is just the Baron de Zoroastre André-Robert de Nerciat Andrea (1739-1800), born in Dijon but of Italian origin, "the last representative of the erotic novel", which Sarane Alexandrian calls "a spiritual personage, educated, knowledge of several languages, music lover [...] whose appearance is that of a worldly cosmopolitan adventurer."

end quote
Immature poets imitate; mature poets steal; bad poets deface what they take, and good poets make it into something better, or at least something different.
T. S. Eliot

Re: The Telescope of Zoroaster - The Lost Documentation Found!

#4
The BnF entry says:
Language: French
Date: 1796
Note:
esoteric book
Trans. Germany in 1797

Other forms: The Key or high cabal of mages
The urn or Zoroaster The key to the science of the Magi
Telescope or Zoroaster Key to great divinatory cabal of mages
Teleskop of Zoroasters Schlüssel zur oder der Magier groszen wahrsagenden Kabala
Zoroaster's telescope
Zoroaster's Telescop Schlüssel zur grossen wahrsagenden oder der Magier Kabala
Sources: Telescope Key Zoroaster or the great divinatory cabal of mages / André-Robert Andréa Nerciat; work presented finally returned to its rightful author and annotated by Alexandre de Danann, 2008
Cioranescu, 18th c. (in: Nerciat, André Robert Andréa): The urn or Zoroaster The key to science of the Magi

Bibliographical manual. psychic or occult sciences / A. L. Caillet, 1912: Telescope Key Zoroaster or the great divinatory cabal of mages.
####

quote

Vital-Puissant, op. cit., p. 52-53, wrote about this book: "This book is cited by Beuchot in the Biographie Universelle Michaud, and in the New General Biography of Didot. Is it a play? Is it a novel? No bibliography indicates. This book is almost unknown and must be very rare. Perhaps it is a satire on Mesmer or Cagliostro, very well known at the time of Nerciat by their quackery and alleged scientific discoveries.

We remember seeing this book yet included in a catalog published in March 1875, the library Th. Sluys in Brussels. This bulletin was very curious as to: "Catalogue of a fine collection of antique books, devoted to women, to love, to marriage, books facetious, satirical, fellows scatalogiques, burlesque, rarities, curiosities, etc.. "We met as No. 879, The Urn of Zoroaster, listed at a price of 30 francs, with the qualification of "rare." Unfortunately, despite the habit of this editor to usually follow his books marked prices with excellent descriptive and bibliographic information, no explanatory note was attached to the book of Nerciat. Therefore we must now remain in this respect, in our perplexity, leaving to others the chance to be happier than we. '

There is a family tradition that the writer would have made a treaty of the cabalistic art, however, this work seems to have been lost.

George Augustus, son of Nerciat wrote about it: "I went to him at Mr. Beuchot to pay my respects and give him a note on the author Felicia etc. As for the book The Urn of Zoroaster, the only copy he had sent to his family was told by my friend Mr Ducaurroy, a person whom we had lost track of in the last 16 years. My mother thinks it was printed Neuwien."

Unpublished letter of George Augustus Nerciat sent October 25, 18?? to A. Beuchot. (B.n.F. Ms. fr. New. acq. 5203, room 281)
end quote
Translated from : http://imagez.free.fr/nerciat/Nerciat_S ... _intro.pdf

Although the original french edition was rare and virtually unknown. The German translation in vol. iii of Das Kloster, a complilation of magical texts and reference source, ensured it was known among some theosophists, occultists and ceremonial magicians. Vol. 3 is referenced in works by Waite, Sepharial and E.M. Butler for example, and Sepharial and Butler make explicit reference to Zoroaster's Telescope. It is likely the Westcott knew it too, an article of his appears in the same issue of 'Lucifer' in which Sepharial's with its reference to the Telescope appears, and both Westcott and Sepharial were both part of Blavatsky's inner circle.
Immature poets imitate; mature poets steal; bad poets deface what they take, and good poets make it into something better, or at least something different.
T. S. Eliot

Re: The Telescope of Zoroaster - The Lost Documentation Found!

#5
Thanks ... after all of this it seems, that there is - for the moment - no base for saying:
"In the mid 1500's an oracle appeared in Germany from an unknown source called Zoroaster's Telescop."
Eric, in your youtube-contribution you speak of a usenet text, that you saw. Do you have this at hand?

Does somebody see anywhere a possibility to get the German edition of 1797? Any title, a publisher, author or something like this? I see from Steve, that this appears just in the French description without details.

Karl Kern's work seems to have been ...
http://www.worldcat.org/title/wahrsagen ... sView=true

Wahrsagende Kabbala der Magier - die Kabbala des Zoroaster (1932/1933), 109 pages. The Nazis gave Nietzsches writings some honor, and Nietzsche stood for Zarathustra, so that's likely the base for a publication just in 1932.

Karl Kern is mentioned in this text ...
http://www.scribd.com/doc/56832590/The- ... i-Ideology
... not very often. But it seems clear, which political direction he had.

*****************

The scheme of the described divination system used 112 elements and it is spoken of Zoroaster, in other words, "about Persia".
There's an old chess version, at least in existence since mid of 14th century, and it is called "Tamerlane Chess", cause Tamerlane loved it. Tamerlane reigned in the region around Persia in a kingdom, which was not much smaller than the old big Persian Empire. Half of Mongolic descend, he was identified with Persia. As Tamerlane didn't fight against Europeans, but against foes of the Europeans, he was perceived with friendly eyes.

Tamerlane Chess uses 112 fields in a strange manner:

Image


2 fields are outside of the board and had a special function. Naturally also the two king positions are "very special".

In the explanation of the divination scheme the 112 elements are parted in 4 groups:

2 Principe
2 Ghosts
9 Intelligences
99 others



Looking at Tamerlane chess, one easily can detect, that the 2 positions of the two kings would make 2 principe.

The 2 additional fields would make 2 Ghosts

The 9 Intelligences could stand for 9 different chess officers without king (from which 2 appear only once at each side - the two figures beside the king - and 7 appear twice at each side).
In the explanation we find, that 7 of the intelligences are given to the "7 planets" (inclusive sun and moon) and 2 are given to "spiritual sun" and "spiritual moon". So again, the number relation between Tamerlane chess and Zoroaster divination system would fit.

The 99 others seem to be a composition of 9x11, so "9 intelligences" multiplied by 11 ... what 11? Well, Tamerlane chess has 11 different pawns.

This is the representation in the German text:

Image


That's not too difficult to read, there's a 9x11-scheme, which generates the 99 numbers, but it's included in a 9x12 scheme in the manner, that the 12 means "sign of the zodiacs" and the 9 means the 9 "Intelligences". The first sign of the zodiac (the "primitive" Aries) gives then the definitions of the Intelligences (and it so NOT part of the 9x11-scheme).

Well, then we see, that there are 9 "cycles" (= zodiacs) and we can recognize, that we know the model: This are simply spheres.

Image

http://trionfi.com/0/m/12/

For instance here we have 8 circles (7 planets plus an 8th called Celum stellata) and above them the 9th, which is shown by Apollo. In the center (in the picture at the bottom) we have the 4 elements.

In the Mantegna Tarocchi we have also spheres at Nr. 41-49, the eight sphere is called Octava shera and 9th picture is called "Primo Mobile"

Image


Image


Well, the whole idea is very old. But in other systems we don't meet the number "112", which is here reached by by adding "9x12" + 4 elements (9x12 = 108 /108 + 4 = 112)

This scheme is slightly different, by putting primo mobile in a 10th cyle:

Image

http://relaxedmachinery.ning.com/profil ... he-spheres

Generally a very common model, occasionally presented a little different.

****************

I've written earlier a lot of Montefeltro's interest in the number 28 (1474-76). The number 28 appears in Tamerlane chess, in which two players play with 28 figures each. The board has in a rather unusual way "112" fields and 112 = 4x28. I had the theory, that Montefeltro had been shown "Tamerlane Chess" by a diplomat from Persia (143/74), actually a Spanish Jew, who worked as physician at the court of Uzun Hassan (king of an greater "Persia"). Uzun Hassan had an alliance with some European states and the current aim had been a joined attack on the Osmans.

Image

(detail of a picture)

The meeting led to picture production with Montefeltro and the Persian diplomat. In the follow-up Montefeltro made a few things (or instance his studiolo got 28 famous men), in which Montefeltro seemed to have been fascinated by the number 28.
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=494

In islam countries the moon calendar has a big role, and the moon is connected to 28 houses. Tamerlane Chess has developed from this background.

***************

In short, we meet in the 18th century divination model some Persian elements and the whole thing is called "Telescope of Zoroaster".
The sphere-model is also old European, but I remember not the appearance of a 112. Does somebody know any use of it in Europe?

From your recent info I see, that there is suspicion, that the author produced the text in Neuwien (which is a new part of Vienna then, if I understand this right).
German wikipedia is better in the German details of the biography of Andréa de Nerciat. Nerciat had a lot of time in Germany. It might well be, that he authored also the German work. Yes, the author had been in Vienna in 1796.

The author had been short before active for the duke of Braunschweig. This (and his father) had been "war heroes" at various opportunities. Another duke of Braunschweig had been Gustav Selenus, a famous chess book author. He also founded a famous library.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augustus_t ... 3%BCneburg
It seems plausible, that the later dukes knew about their prominent ancestor and they knew likely also something of chess. In 19th century Germany became famous for his chess players. Braunschweig is not far from Ströbeck (45 km), the German chess village.

Well, Nerciat worked some time in German libraries. The duke of Braunschweig-Wolfenbüttel ...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Wi ... %C3%BCttel
... became a great man, when he became chief commander in an army, which intended to save the French monarchy in 1792. The canon battle of Valmy ...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Valmy
... didn't have the result, which was desired. The French revolution survived. Two years later he retired from his position.

Nerciat biography: "Im Jahr 1792 fungierte er als Unterhändler des Herzogs von Braunschweig, dem er seine Dienste als Geheimagent angeboten hatte".
He worked as diplomat and "secret agent" for the duke in 1792. Nerciat likely was known to the duke from other opportunities before, I would assume, but I have no confirmation. But it seems not plausible, that he was acceptable in this function, if he wasn't acquainted with him longer time before. Some time Nerciat had been at the court in Kassel and Braunschweig and Kassel are not far (150 km). The Landgraf of Kassel earned his money, by lending a lot of soldiers to the American battlefield, so he was a natural factor in the war games of 2n part of 18th century. The war duke of Braunschweig Wolfenbüttel should have been occasionally at this court, which had some fame for his festivities.

Nerciat anyway had a career as secret agent. One is only not sure, for whom he worked all the time.

If such an exotic game as the Tamerlane chess was known in Europe, the address of Braunschweig-Wolfenbüttel would take a first place for knowing something about it.
Huck
http://trionfi.com

Re: The Telescope of Zoroaster - The Lost Documentation Found!

#6
Well,
I made some research, when Tamerlane Chess became known in Europe. For the current moment it's more or less negative.

Tamerlane had a sort of critical biography in 1436, but not in Europe. This was the author.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmad_ibn_Arabshah

As a first European biography-writers are noted Petrus Perondinus, Florence (1551 or 1553) and Pedro Maxia (1543), Spain, called an imperial historian, who wrote a series of Imperial biographies (stories of emperors). These texts went to Christopher Marlowe, who wrote a theater play, which is often discussed.
Around the same we have some interest for Zorostrism, which we earlier followed in the intensive Plethon thread (Aeclectic).

I stumbled variously about the idea, that Zoroaster invented Chess ... though I don't know, who started this.

*****************

I found the following ... a reaction of 1798 on the Telescope de Zoroaster. Author is Abbe Barruel ...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augustin_Barruel
.... who in wikipedia is presented with:
Abbé Augustin Barruel (October 2, 1741 – October 5, 1820) was a French Jesuit priest. He is now mostly known for setting forth the conspiracy theory involving the Bavarian Illuminati and the Jacobins in his book Memoirs Illustrating the History of Jacobinism (original title Mémoires pour servir à l'Histoire du Jacobinisme) published in 1797. In short, Barruel wrote that the French Revolution was planned and executed by the secret societies.
He wrote in England where he had found some refugium. In 1802 he returned to France.

The text is given here:
http://books.google.de/books?id=TyQPAAA ... ak&f=false

Image


Image


Image


Image


Well, he sees, that this system developed in Prussia. He thinks, that there is a dedication to a specific prince, but he doesn't name it, and my impression is, that he also isn't named in the Telescope de Zoroaster (but somebody is addressed as Seigneur.
From these free-masons he draws in his later texts a line to the Martinists, where he tells a longer story of Manes, which should be Mani, founder of the Manichaeism.

Well, there is a "true name" "Oromasis" and I looked up, what I could find about it.

**************

Oromasis:
Charles Dickens in 1857 noted ...
http://books.google.de/books?id=qNonAQA ... is&f=false

Image


The's a name Abbé de Villars.

**************

Abbé de Villars:

Biography by sacred texts:
http://www.sacred-texts.com/eso/cdg/cdg02.htm

born 1635, came 1667 with some enthusiasm to Paris, preached, and was killed 1673.
Few of the works to-day attributed to the Abbé were written by him. They are forgeries contrived, as are the sequels and interpolations in the later editions of Comte de Gabalis itself, by those who feared and sought to nullify the profound influence which this book exercised over the minds and imaginations of its readers. For there were those who regarded the truth which it embodies as unorthodox and harmful to the temporal authority of the church.

To a politico-religious source may therefore be ascribed the ingenious fiction that Comte de Gabalis is a direct translation of an Italian book La Chiave del Gabinetto, by Gioseppe Borri, published in 1681, eleven years after the appearance of the first edition of these Discourses. Thoughtful comparison of La Chiave del Gabinetto, with the contemporary French and English editions of Comte de Gabalis reveals the fact that the Italian book is but a faulty translation and expansion of the former, masquerading under the guise of letters dated from Copenhagen in 1666, which imaginary date was employed to lend colour to its pretension to priority, and to cast discredit upon the Abbé's book.
There's the name of a book: "Comte de Gabalis"

***************

Comte de Gabalis, published 1670
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comte_de_Gabalis

Version of 1913:
http://www.sacred-texts.com/eso/cdg/index.htm

Original edition: 1670
http://books.google.de/books?id=GeYeT7H ... is&f=false

Le Comte de Gabalis, ou Entretiens sur les sciences secrètes [par l'abbé de Montfaucon de Villars]...
Nicolas-Pierre-Henri de Montfaucon de Villars
chez Claude Barbin, 1670


Image


Image


Image


Image


Image


Image


Image


Image


This seems to have given birth to this passage in the Sacred-books-passage of the 1913 edition at ...
http://www.sacred-texts.com/eso/cdg/cdg08.htm
Lactantius has reasoned better," the Comte replied, "and cautious Thomas Aquinas has learnedly determined not only that these intimacies, may be fruitful, but also that the children thus born are of a far nobler and more heroic nature. In fact, when it pleases you, you shall read of the lofty deeds of those mighty and famous men LXXXIV whom Moses says were born in this manner. We have their records in our possession in the Book of the Wars of the Lord LXXXV, cited in the twenty-first chapter of the Book of Numbers. Meantime just think what the world would be if all its inhabitants were like Zoroaster."

"What!" said I, "Zoroaster whom people say was the inventor of necromancy?"

"The same of whom the ignorant have written that calumny," said the Comte. "He had the honour of being the son of the Salamander Oromasis and of Vesta, Noah's wife. He lived for twelve hundred years, the sagest monarch in the world, and then was carried away to the Region of the Salamanders by his father Oromasis."

"I do not doubt that Zoroaster is with the Salamander Oromasis in the Region of Fire," said I, "but I should not like to put such an affront upon Noah as you have been guilty of."

"The affront is not so great as you might think,"
replied the Comte; "all your patriarchs considered it a great honour to be the reputed fathers of those children whom the Sons of God were pleased to have by their wives LXXXVI, but as yet this is too much for you. Let us return to Oromasis. He was beloved by Vesta, Noah's wife. This Vesta after her death became the tutelary genius of Rome, and the Sacred Fire LXXXVII, which she desired the virgins to preserve with so much care, was in honour of the Salamander, her lover. Besides Zoroaster, there sprang from their love a daughter of rare beauty and wisdom, the divine Egeria, from whom Numa Pompilius received all his laws. She compelled Numa, whom she loved, to build a temple to Vesta XC, her mother, where the Sacred Fire should be maintained in honour of her father Oromasis. This is the truth concerning the fable about the Nymph Egeria which Roman poets and historians have related."

"William Postel, least ignorant of all those who have studied the Cabala in ordinary books, was aware that Vesta was Noah's wife LXXXVIII, but he did not know that Egeria was Vesta's daughter, and not having read the secret books of the ancient Cabala, a copy of which the Prince de Mirande LXXXIX bought so dearly, he confused things and believed that Egeria was merely the good genius of Noah's wife."

"In those books we learn that Egeria was conceived upon the waters when Noah was wandering upon the avenging floods which inundated the Universe. Women were at that time reduced to the small number who were saved in the Cabalistic Ark, built by that second father of mankind."

"This illustrious man, mourning over the frightful chastisement wherewith the Lord was punishing the crimes caused by Adam's love for Eve, and seeing that Adam had ruined his posterity by preferring her to the daughters of the Elements and by taking her from that Salamander or Sylph who would have gained her affection--Noah, I say, profited by the fatal example of Adam and was content that his wife Vesta should yield herself to the Salamander Oromasis, Prince of Fiery Beings; and persuaded his three sons likewise to surrender their three wives to the Princes of the three other Elements. The Universe was, in a short time, re-peopled with heroic men, so learned, so handsome, so admirable, that their posterity dazzled by their virtues has mistaken them for divinities. One of Noah's children, rebelling against his father's counsel, could not resist the attractions of his wife any more than Adam could withstand the charms of his Eve . But just as Adam's sin blackened the souls of all his descendants, so Ham's lack of complaisance for the Sylphs branded all his black posterity; whence comes the horrible complexion of the Ethiopians, say our Cabalists, and of all those hideous peoples who have been commanded to dwell in the torrid zone as punishment for the profane ardour of their father."

"These are very singular fancies, Sir," said I, marvelling at the man's ravings, "and your Cabala is of wonderful service in illuminating antiquity."

"Of wonderful service," he rejoined gravely, "and without it Scripture, history, fable and Nature are obscure and unintelligible. You believe, for example, that the injury Ham did his father was what it seems literally to be; as a matter of fact, it was something quite different. Noah went forth from the Ark, and perceiving that his wife Vesta had but grown more beautiful through her love for Oromasis, fell passionately in love with her again. Ham fearing that his father was about to re-people the earth with progeny as black as his own Ethiopians, seized his 'opportunity one day when the old man was full of wine, and mercilessly maltreated him. You laugh?"

"I laugh at Ham's indiscreet zeal," said I.

"Rather," replied he, "admire the kindness of the Salamander Oromasis, whom jealousy did not prevent from taking pity upon the disgrace of his rival. He taught his son Zoroaster, otherwise known as Japhet, XCI the Name of Omnipotent God which expresses His eternal fecundity. Japhet pronounced the Redoubtable Name JABAMIAH XCII six times alternately with his brother Shem, walking backward towards the patriarch, and they completely restored the old man. This story, misunderstood, caused the Greeks to say that the oldest of the Gods was maltreated by one of his children ...
******************

I look for other "Oromasis" appearances and find some (9). I've to look for them ...

... but I got also the suspicion, that Oromasis might be just a writing form for Ourobourus.
Huck
http://trionfi.com

Re: The Telescope of Zoroaster - The Lost Documentation Found!

#7
A piece of art, Hades steals Persephone ...

Image

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schloss_Vechelde

... commissioned in 1770 by Duke Ferdinand of Brunswick-Wolfenbüttel (12 January 1721, Wolfenbüttel – 3 July 1792, Brunswick).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferdinand_of_Brunswick
A war-hero, especially active for Fredrick the Great of Prussia in the 7-years-war. After the war there was a split between Ferdinand and Fredrick, and Fredrick retired to Schloss Vechelde and its garden. There he lived about 25 years till his death ... active for Freemaonry.

The English wikipedia article of the Bavarian Illuminati ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illuminati
The movement was founded on May 1, 1776, in Ingolstadt (Upper Bavaria) as the Order of the Illuminati, with an initial membership of five, by Jesuit-taught Adam Weishaupt (d. 1830), who was the first lay professor of canon law at the University of Ingolstadt. It was made up of freethinkers as an offshoot of the Enlightenment and seems to have been modeled on the Freemasons. The Illuminati's members took a vow of secrecy and pledged obedience to their superiors. Members were divided into three main classes, each with several degrees, and many Illuminati chapters drew membership from existing Masonic lodges.

Originally Weishaupt had planned the order to be named the "Perfectibilists". The group has also been called the Bavarian Illuminati and its ideology has been called "Illuminism". Many influential intellectuals and progressive politicians counted themselves as members, including Ferdinand of Brunswick and the diplomat Xavier von Zwack, the second-in-command of the order. The order had branches in most European countries: it reportedly had around 2,000 members over the span of ten years. It attracted literary men such as Johann Wolfgang von Goethe and Johann Gottfried Herder and the reigning dukes of Gotha and Weimar.
... notes the same Ferdinand of Brunswick as the first and an important member with noble descend.

Going back to our Jesuit informant of 1797 (Abbé Augustin Barruel), who spoke of Prussia as the origin of the Zoroaster divination and a German prince, whose name he avoids to tell ...

compare:
Image


... then this Ferdinand might be the right choice. Ferdinand von Brunswick, who had contact to the author Nerciat and fought the French in 1792, was his nephew:
Charles William Ferdinand (German: Karl Wilhelm Ferdinand, Fürst und Herzog von Braunschweig-Wolfenbüttel) (October 9, 1735 – November 10, 1806)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Wilhe ... k-Luneburg

I find a note, that this was also a Freemason (since c. 1771) in a work about Brunswick Freemasonry:
http://books.google.de/books?id=UikiAAA ... navlinks_s.
Geschichte der Freimaurerei in Braunschweig von 1744 bis Neujahr 1844:
aus den Protocollen und Archiven der Carl zur gekrönten Säule ausgezogen
Fr. H. A. Lachmann
F. Otto, 1844

I found a freemasonry dictionary, and both persons are noted inside:

Image


Image


Dictionary:
Vol 1: http://books.google.de/books?id=grBRAAA ... navlinks_s
Vol 2: http://books.google.de/books?id=lbBRAAA ... navlinks_s
Vol 3: http://books.google.de/books?id=cCQZAAA ... milarbooks
Enzyklopädie der Freimaurerei:
nebst Nachrichten über die damit in wirklicher oder vorgeblicher Beziehung stehenden geheimen Verbindungen : in alphabet. Ordnung, Volume 1
... Hesse, Friedrich Mossdorf
Brockhaus, 1822 - 1824 - 1828

Zoroaster is also a theme for this dictionary, though a relation to the divination system is not recognizable.The content is usual (carried together from other dictionaries), the most interesting part is the list of current literature at the end.

Image


A name is mentioned of a person (red passage), who brought a lot of important texts from Persia about Zoroaster and the religion. He started to publish in 1771. The person is identified as ...

Abraham Hyacinthe Anquetil-Duperron (7 December 1731-17 January 1805)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abraham_Hy ... l-Duperron

The following German Zoroaster literature related to this input. If there was German Zoroaster enthusiasm in German Freemasonry cycles, which led in some way to the "Telescope of Zoroaster" (1796) it likely depended on this development ... that is, what seems to be logical in the moment.

*****************

I could find, that Tamerlane Chess at least in 1694 was known in England.
compare: viewtopic.php?f=11&p=12744#p12744
Huck
http://trionfi.com

Re: The Telescope of Zoroaster - The Lost Documentation Found!

#8
Huck wrote
I look for other "Oromasis" appearances and find some (9). I've to look for them ...

... but I got also the suspicion, that Oromasis might be just a writing form for Ourobourus.
You might also try the spelling "Oromazes", in Plutarch's Isis and Osiris (sections XLVI-XLVII at http://thriceholy.net/Texts/Isis.html, or section 46-47 at http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/R ... is*/C.html), In the doctrine of Zoroaster as related there, he is the god or principle of good things and the light, who exists along with his opposite Arimanios, the principle of bad things and darkness; between them is Mithras the mediator.

Re: The Telescope of Zoroaster - The Lost Documentation Found!

#9
mikeh wrote: You might also try the spelling "Oromazes", in Plutarch's Isis and Osiris (sections XLVI-XLVII at http://thriceholy.net/Texts/Isis.html, or section 46-47 at http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/R ... is*/C.html), In the doctrine of Zoroaster as related there, he is the god or principle of good things and the light, who exists along with his opposite Arimanios, the principle of bad things and darkness; between them is Mithras the mediator.
This model is just "dualism" and as a scheme it is made by the I-Ching. "Good and bad" replace Yang and Yin and both have 6 followers ... the I-Ching has 6 abstract lines to present its divination model. The same is used by Hesiod for six male Titans, which "marry" six female (with the exemption, that Zeus gets two of them ... well, a matter of Eros). And in the bible we have it with six days of creation and a 7th to take a look at it.

Interestingly Thomas Hyde, the scholar for Persian matters , who wrote about Tamerlane Chess, was the first, who used the word Dualism.
Leibniz, contemporary to Hyde, had invented the binary numeral system, which is dualism without content (1679). Leibniz became interested in China, and made a lot to get a connection to the Jesuits in China ... a troublesome, as letters took a very long time. He detected the I-Ching, and was puzzled about the I-Ching, which also functions with binary units. Leibniz learned about Go, the board game, Hyde learned about the Go game (he had a Chinese in Oxford). Leibniz had a very close connection to the house of Braunschweig (his sponsors; that, which later got some importance for the Freemasons), Braunschweig had close connection to the English throne and with this to Thomas Hyde. Leibniz was even in London. But I found nothing about a connection between Leibniz and Hyde.

In his later years Leibniz got trouble about the accusation, that he had stolen something from Newton.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leibniz%E2 ... ontroversy
He hadn't then help from his sponsors, as Hannover/Braunschweig was interested to have no conflict in the British Empire. Leibniz suffered from this late accusations.
Huck
http://trionfi.com

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests

cron