Tarot History Forum

Ross G. R. Caldwell wrote:

marco wrote:

Ross G. R. Caldwell wrote: 3. The trump series originally had a coherent meaning.

Does this leave Dummett out of our group?
Not sure...

Marco

I don't know (I don't think so, though), but I am sure all of US agree on this.

Ross

I'm not sure, sometimes if I wonder if what we have is a remainder of a combination of several decks, but I have nothing to back that up with other than a tiny pondering, so I won't argue it. It stays until rebutted.

robert wrote:

Ross G. R. Caldwell wrote: 5. Every one of the original orders has a coherent symbolic meaning.
6. Not every tarot trump series has a coherent meaning.

Can you clarify that for me (just slightly confused).

A, B and C meant something to the people who arranged the trumps in those orders. There was a "narrative" in each order.

But for 6, this means that we can't apply that to every image on every type of deck produced. That is, some images may not convey part of the narrative sequence - the vignettes below the Star, Moon and Sun in various decks might not mean anything in the context of the narrative, in other words. They, and other cards in various decks, and whole decks (like the Animal decks and 19th century genre scenes of course) may have no coherent narrative at all.

Ross G. R. Caldwell wrote:

robert wrote:

Ross G. R. Caldwell wrote: 5. Every one of the original orders has a coherent symbolic meaning.
6. Not every tarot trump series has a coherent meaning.

Can you clarify that for me (just slightly confused).

A, B and C meant something to the people who arranged the trumps in those orders. There was a "narrative" in each order.

But for 6, this means that we can't apply that to every image on every type of deck produced. That is, some images may not convey part of the narrative sequence - the vignettes below the Star, Moon and Sun in various decks might not mean anything in the context of the narrative, in other words. They, and other cards in various decks, and whole decks (like the Animal decks and 19th century genre scenes of course) may have no coherent narrative at all.

Thanks Ross; and for anyone seeking further information on the A, B, and C orderings, see these two excellent pages:
http://it.geocities.com/a_pollett/cards26.htm
http://www.tarothermit.com/ordering2.htm

9. There is no esoteric, alchemical, kabbalistic, numerological, geomantic, astrological, heretical, magical, or any other message than what an averagely educated 15th century Italian would recognize, in the narrative of the trumps.

Ross G. R. Caldwell wrote:9. There is no esoteric, alchemical, kabbalistic, numerological, geomantic, astrological, heretical, magical, or any other message than what an averagely educated 15th century Italian would recognize, in the narrative of the trumps.

You're trying to end the game? I'll be shocked if this one stands, I was hoping we could get further than 9 points! Well, let's see.

robert wrote:

Ross G. R. Caldwell wrote:9. There is no esoteric, alchemical, kabbalistic, numerological, geomantic, astrological, heretical, magical, or any other message than what an averagely educated 15th century Italian would recognize, in the narrative of the trumps.

You're trying to end the game? I'll be shocked if this one stands, I was hoping we could get further than 9 points! Well, let's see.

Well, nobody disagreed yet - I'm sure we'll get further though. The day is young.

LOL.

Well, let's try a fairly straightforward one.

A "standard Tarot Deck" includes 1 Fool, 21 Trumps, 16 Court cards, and 40 Pips equalling 78 cards in total.

hello all,

My opinion is:

Tarot game is a 78 cards decks who has a global sense (I means a Code).

But may be it is not the good place to say this.

Best,

Yves

Yves Le Marseillais wrote:hello all,

My opinion is:

Tarot game is a 78 cards decks who has a global sense (I means a Code).

But may be it is not the good place to say this.

Best,

Yves

Yves, by "code", do you mean "secret code"? Or do you just mean "meaning"?

Are we stuck? Add it or leave it off until clarification?