Re: What are the documents for Marziano's dates?

#101
I haven' t followed this thread since it's beginning so maybe you ve already looked at this old inquiry
Oren Margolis in The Politics of Culture in Quattrocento Europe: René of Anjou in Italy
pp 110 114 writes, but with some fancies I believe, this story :

"The idea of the gift {to Isabelle de Lorraine] would have come from Scipine Carafa
who stopped at the Venetian Sforza camp outside Milan on his return from Charles VII 's court.
Marcello, Sforza and Giovanni, the core of the Croissant in Italy, were all three together at this time. Carafa came across a deck of cards during his visit to the camp and told Marcello that this sort of gift was perfect for René's wife; Not satisfied with the deck however, Marcello somehow managed to obtain the Visconti xards from inside the city (Milan). He also have the treatise on "tarot" (sic) by Marziano da Tortona that accompagnied them transcribed by Michele Salvatico, a proeminent Venice based scribe, and, on 12 november 1449, dispathched these to Provence (sic). He sent them by means of the man who happened to be his house guest : non other than King René right hand man, Giovanni Cossa.
This combination of prearranged gify with the intentionnal explotation of valuable network channels was a practice that Marcello will soon make all his own".
https://books.google.fr/books?id=GejnCw ... ds&f=false

(My initial interest at time was more about an hypothetic indirect PROVENCE connection via Cossa and not directly to ANJOU ...: "and, on 12 november 1449, dispathched these to Provence (sic). He sent them by means of the man who happened to be his house guest : non other than King René right hand man, Giovanni Cossa.")

Quid of Scipine Carafa?
"The idea of the gift {to Isabelle de Lorraine] would have come from Scipine Carafa
who stopped at the Venetian Sforza camp outside Milan on his return from Charles VII 's court.
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=691&p=18013&hilit=broi+rene#p18013

Huck had answered :
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=691&hilit=broi+ren ... 110#p18114
I'd explained the situation, and asked, when all three were together, possibly also Scipio.

Huck questionned the author and got this answer :
"I also mention the three men in the camp on p. 53, and discuss some other aspects of their relationship in that first chapter which might be of interest to you. But the other place you should look is Margaret King's book, The Death of the Child Valerio Marcello (1994), where she reconstructs many aspects of the chronology of Marcello's career and the careers of his friends."

Huck concluded :
I don't have page 53 and I don't have the introduction. And I doubt, that he knows the date, when Scipio Caraffa was in the camp.
Huck' closes the topic with the link to Margaret King's book :
https://books.google.de/books?id=RdWeII ... io&f=false

Nota : the thread then documents data about
1. the Crescent Order
2. the 1479 command of luxuous cards (hand painted?) decks for King René...
http://www.sgdl-auteurs.org/alain-bouge ... Biographie

Re: What are the documents for Marziano's dates?

#102
mikeh wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 11:20
Phaeded wrote (in yesterday's posts)
In the period we are talking about, one is not merely famous for being famous (e.g., Kim Kardashian in our own damned times), one was famous for something...and that something was always Virtue in general, or the canonical virtues named specifically, especially prudence when it came to rulers (and almost op[posed to them having overcome Fortuna through the virtues).
Well, Fame is still different from Prudence, with different attributes. Prudence did not have a crown as an attribute. The crown does imply Fame worthy of a Prince, literally or metaphorically. And yes, Fame is for something, and in a prince probably many of the virtues, and in the CY including all seven. That is why the card is at or near the end of the sequence. But Prudence is a virtue for everyone, not especially rulers. That's why it would have its own card.

Dead wrong. By the 15th century, the Mirror for Princes genre had especially elevated Prudence as the virtue of rulers (again, Pizan's Othea/prudence is just one of many examples of this genre; Bruni too elevated Prudence to the highest virtue for running Florentine Republic - this is why the highest trump is Prudence, or rather the fame of so&so's prudence [Sforza, Florence, etc.]). So while it is true that all of the seven virtues of course have meaning for every individual, the special relevance of prudence for rulers goes back to the unimpeachable authority of Thomas Aquinas:
Article 11. ...."Political prudence," which is directed to the common good of the state, "domestic economy" which is of such things as relate to the common good of the household or family, and "monastic economy" which is concerned with things affecting the good of one person, are all distinct sciences. Therefore in like manner there are different kinds of prudence, corresponding to the above differences of matter.

I answer that, As stated above (Article 5; II-II:54:2 ad 1), the species of habits differ according to the difference of object considered in its formal aspect. Now the formal aspect of all things directed to the end, is taken from the end itself, as shown above (Prologue to I-II; I-II:102:1), wherefore the species of habits differ by their relation to different ends. Again the individual good, the good of the family, and the good of the city and kingdom are different ends. Wherefore there must needs be different species of prudence corresponding to these different ends, so that one is "prudence" simply so called, which is directed to one's own good; another, "domestic prudence" which is directed to the common good of the home; and a third, "political prudence," which is directed to the common good of the state or kingdom.

Article 12....I answer that, Prudence is in the reason. Now ruling and governing belong properly to the reason; and therefore it is proper to a man to reason and be prudent in so far as he has a share in ruling and governing. But it is evident that the subject as subject, and the slave as slave, are not competent to rule and govern, but rather to be ruled and governed. Therefore prudence is not the virtue of a slave as slave, nor of a subject as subject.

Since, however, every man, for as much as he is rational, has a share in ruling according to the judgment of reason, he is proportionately competent to have prudence. Wherefore it is manifest that prudence is in the ruler "after the manner of a mastercraft" (Ethic. vi, 8), but in the subjects, "after the manner of a handicraft."
http://www.newadvent.org/summa/3047.htm#article10
The relevance of different types of prudence for people in different stations in life is clear. Political prudence is the special province of rulers. Rulers are famous, or want to be famous (the hoi polloi are prudently minding their on business). Please tell me you understand this.
mikeh wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 11:20
Phaeded wrote
And your glossing of Petrarchan Eternity for tarot's Judgement is not born by the examples we have of either.
Well, that is true, except for a "God the Father" at the top of the CY and PMB cards.
In the act of Judgement. He's not overseeing the End Times or resurrection in the Petrarchan theme of Eternity. These are not minor distinctions in the middle ages/"early modern" period.
mikeh wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 11:20
Phaeded wrote
So you've ignored my limiting caveat - Medici art (explicitly commissioned by them, and at least implicit of their power in Florence) - and none of the examples you gave above are from the corpus of commissioned Medicean art.
I have perhaps misunderstood you. I will have to think about this one. Added a little later: First, the halberd has a meaning independently of "Medici art", and was used as such in art of the time. Military prowess brings fame. My examples are relevant to that extent. I do not think "Medici art" is a valid name for a specific tradition in art, in which alone the halberd has meaning, defined by two examples.
The halberd by itself is just one weapon among many, like the standard astrological depictions of Mars (including in the Visconti Hours below), where the god in his planetary guise is almost always loaded down with a crossbow, spear and halberd (3rd down from the upper left - the planets surrounding 'Creation of the Sun, Moon and Stars', LF37v in Kirsch/Meiss)):
Image

"Military prowess" associated specifically with the halberd gained political currency after the Duke of Burgundy had his helmet/skull crushed through by a halberd after losing the battle of Nancy in 1477 (see the reference to that in The Politics of Culture in Quattrocento Europe: Rene of Anjou in Italy, Oren Margolis, linked above by Alain B.). The Pazzi War erupted the next year, ergo, the symbol then had currency.

And I did not argue "'Medici art' is a valid name for a specific tradition in art, in which alone the halberd has meaning, defined by two examples." What I said was thus:
1. The CVI Chariot clearly shows a ruler, which in Medicean Florence means...a Medici.
2. The ruler on the Chariot holds a halberd, unprecedented in the corpus of Medici art commissions - why?
3. There are only two examples of Medici art commissions that feature the halberd (and yes, you can dispute they actually commissioned the CVI, but if not them, someone who was a committed Medici partisan and likely a member of the Dieci), and one, Botticelli's Minerva and Centaur, can be definitely placed at the conclusion of the Pazzi War in 1482. I would further argue the Botticelli piece is in some ways a commentary on the earlier CVI Chariot - the halberd, once gripped and aggressively pointing out from the ruler's face, is now turned away from Minerva's face, cradled against her body, not to be used in the immediate interaction with the Centaur (which is merely controlled by grabbing the forelock, docilely, via her "wisdom", again in a symbolic gesture of Fortuna-Occasio).

To restate what I obviously meant from the beginning: I am not talking about a genre - just two otherwise unexplained examples of halberds linked to expressions of Medici power, in regard to the same event: the Pazzi War. Otherwise the Medici do not associate themselves with the halberd. No tradition/genre, just two instances.
mikeh wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 11:20
Of course there is evidence to explain away, namely the evidence that Maggio presents for the Alessandro Sforza being pre-1440 (similar in nature to what you give for 1475, namely, historical events), and that Fiorini, and Belossi before her, present for the Rothschild cards being pre-1440 (in this case stylistic; I have reproduced and translated their writings at http://rothschildcards.blogspot.com/).
I skimmed back through that. Dated documentary proof (Giusti's giornali) is incontrovertible; dating due to artistic style/dress varies with the art historian you care to reference is up for grabs. Its telling you have to preface that long blog piece with whether the cards are even tarot (vs. imperatori). And all of Ross's criticisms are still valid. There are numerous examples of International Gothic paralleling the date of the CY and beyond. I assume that to some degree that tarot decks took on the function of copybooks for artists, so not surprising at all to see anachronisms in later decks. I'll entertain a pre-1440 theory as soon as you find concrete date-able evidence, and not solely the fetishistic theories of art historians. Until then, I'll note that Ross rightfully never tires of pointing out that until 1440, no evidence, and after 1440 a burst of documented evidence. The onus is not on a 1440 theory for the ur-tarot.

As for Dummett, he never came close to explaining the meaning of the individual Trumps or why that selection of subjects formed the trumps; he just identified regional sequences (one only look at his book on the PMB to see how self-evident that statement is).

Phaeded

Re: What are the documents for Marziano's dates?

#103
Ross wrote :
"sure we can assume René had "motive."
I don't know the evidence that he, personally, played cards. He likes jousts and tournaments, spectacles like that, maybe chess (there is an inventory of his belongings), but I don't recall him owning any packs of cards."

Ross
IT IS NOT TRUE THAT THERE ARE NO HISTORICAL DATA ABOUT CARDS IN RENE LIFE APART THE 1449 REFERENCE FOR ISBELLE DE LORRAINE

I had checked in Avignon Library. and there is a mention one year before his death of a command of two decks. on January 15th 1479 to
Armand Tavernier, peintre, originaire du diocèse de Lyon, plus précisément de Montbrison, fixé en Avignon, en 1446, mort en 1482.
Référence :
D'AGNEL 1908
Entry 565 p.198 Volume I : René's Comptes listing the command of the two decks to Tavernier

Abbé G Arnaud D'Agnel Les Comptes du Roi René publiés d'après les originaux conservés aux Archives des Bouches du Rhône Tome Premier
Paris Librairie Alphonse Picard et Fils Librairie des Archives Nationales et de la Société de l' Ecole des Chartes 1908[
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=691&hilit=broi+ren ... 160#p18222

Two decks for René.
Now, the price seems a priori high and the order is for a paintor ': "hand painted luxury cards" as speculated Chobaut ?
Probably we'll never know if these two decks were hand painted (I think so because Tavernier is a painter) or if these "jeux de cartes" were luxury decks (the amount of the command included other objects) ...
Well, maybe you knew about this entry but then why not mention it, maybe you did not and this is new...

For more information about this entry see :
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=691&hilit=broi+rene&start=150


Specific posts about this entry : a little tricky because I had to go from Chobaut to Pansier and finally D'Agnel...
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=691&hilit=broi+ren ... 150#p18197

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=691&hilit=broi+ren ... 150#p18195

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=691&hilit=broi+ren ... 150#p18218

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=691&hilit=broi+ren ... 160#p18220


Nota bene
Maybe of interest also, an entry dated July 1478 talks of "cartes" amonst other goods - of finally little value - of Florentine ships in the Port of BOUC (that is Port de Bouc near Marseille) brought to René : are these cartes à jouer or cartes geographiques? No precision.
http://www.sgdl-auteurs.org/alain-bouge ... Biographie

Re: What are the documents for Marziano's dates?

#104
Thank you very much, Alain! I had missed all of this from the Comptes of King René the first time around, in 2016.

I've been reading all of the original stuff you had posted then, and now. Thank you for posting a picture of the original entry, number 565. It is a shame that D'Agnel is not available online, I'd like to read all of the accounts, especially if there is any indication that he took over Isabelle's possessions after her death in February, 1453. I believe that he did, but there might be something in the comptes that is direct evidence.

For my point about René's interest in cards, it is not that I don't think he could have played cards, I imagined that he did, but I just had no evidence for it, so I had no basis to speculate. 1479 is only one year before he died, so it is a late example. But it is something.

It is not earth-shaking to know if René got the book (and cards?) or if Isabelle gave it to someone else, because it was already in the first catalogue of the library at Blois in 1518, and in all of the catalogues of the Royal library from that time forward until today. It is only to wonder what happened to it after 1453, which might shed light on where the cards went.
Image

Re: What are the documents for Marziano's dates?

#105
Phaeded wrote (viewtopic.php?p=21360#p21360)
As for Dummett, he never came close to explaining the meaning of the individual Trumps or why that selection of subjects formed the trumps; he just identified regional sequences (one only look at his book on the PMB to see how self-evident that statement is).
The point is that Dummett postulated the origin of the tarot as considerably earlier than any direct evidence for it. Is there something about the meaning of the individual trumps that he didn't know that counts against such postulation? If so, what? Is there something about the selection of subjects that formed the trumps that forestalls such postulation? As I recall, your claimed source, Dante, was considerably earlier than 1430 and even 1410.

Also, I do not see how Dante's Paradiso explains the particular selection of subjects. There are a great many subjects in Dante's Paradiso,, e.g. the 7 planets and 12 zodiacal signs, most of which are not in the tarot. It seems to me that Petrarch's Trionfi poem titles and the cardinal virtues explain 10 of 14. The four "papi" have ludic precedents: those of Marziano's 4x4 leaders of 4 orders and that of "VIII Imperadori" as 4x2 (even if we don't know who precisely the "imperadori" were; but Johannes had 4 empires, and Karnoffel had the Emperor and Pope as the trumps immediately above the Kings). These make up precisely 14, with no piles of leftover subjects, and are even in more or less the same order as in the sources, in all the numerous 15th-16th century tarot sources available to us.

Phaeded wrote, about my pointing to God the Father on top of the CY and PMB Angel cards:
In the act of Judgement. He's not overseeing the End Times or resurrection in the Petrarchan theme of Eternity. These are not minor distinctions in the middle ages/"early modern" period.
Well, angels are blowing trumpets, and people at the bottom of the card are standing in open graves. It is the End Times and the resurrection of the dead, with God the Father calling the shots. It is the triumph of Eternity over Time, even if not in Petrarchan images. It is the general concept that matters, not individual details. Or do I misunderstand?

Now about Prudence. Yes, rulers are or want to be famous. I don't disagree. So do many other people: athletes, scholars, poets, etc. The issue is whether the card has especially to do with prudence, not with fame, which it certainly does have to do with. And even with fame, there are other types of fame, cognate with glory, of which the most important is fame in heaven, hence above the arc of the sky or the clouds below the tondo of the globe. Such fame is earned by virtue, not titles. I know there is a soldier at the bottom of the Visconti card, but the subject is the same as in Florence and in whatever cheap decks were being produced then. The game of triumphs was not just for Malatestas and Sforzas, I hope you agree, whatever hidden messages there may be in a card specifically designed for one person or couple. In 1442 decks are recorded for two aristocratic children in Ferrara, and in 1443 two men in a poor district of Florence near the jail.

Yes, rulers need to practice political prudence, and because of their power and responsibility their mastery of the virtue is more crucial to the well being of society. But if you read article 10 of Aquinas on Prudence, just preceding what you quoted, you will see that it is incumbent on everyone to practice political prudence. (http://www.newadvent.org/summa/3047.htm#article10)
...the prudence that is directed to the common good is called "political" prudence, ... ...since man is a part of the home and state, he must needs consider what is good for him by being prudent about the good of the many. For the good disposition of parts depends on their relation to the whole; thus Augustine says (Confess. iii, 8) that "any part which does not harmonize with its whole, is offensive."
This is not to say that prudence in a ruler (of a state) is the same as prudence in a subject. it "differs specifically. even as the virtue of a man and of a woman", Aquinas says. That is where the distinction between "mastercraft" and "handicraft" comes in. But both are political prudence.

And yes, prudence pertains to ruling. But prudence as such is still for everyone, because everyone has a share in ruling, in so far as they are rational animals. Not qua subject or qua slave, but qua rational animal. (Aristotle's "qua" is translated as "as".)

Article 12 of Aquinas, which you quote, has as its title "Whether prudence is in subjects, or only in their rulers?" The people he is arguing against say it is only in rulers. Aquinas disagrees, saying, as you quoted him (but didn't put in bold) "Therefore prudence is not only in rulers but also in subjects" and "Since, however, every man, for as much as he is rational, has a share in ruling according to the judgment of reason, he is proportionately competent to have prudence." Prudence even pertains to slaves: not qua slave, or qua subject, but qua rational animal, in the same Article 12, reply 2: "he [the slave] does take counsel [part of being prudent] in so far as he is a rational animal. " There is also reply 3: "By prudence a man commands not only others, but also himself, in so far as the reason is said to command the lower powers." (http://www.newadvent.org/summa/3047.htm#article12). Everyone has lower powers to command in himself or herself. Anyone who can reason has a duty to be master over whatever befits his station to govern, even a slave. So Prudence needs to be there as its own card, with its own attributes. It is not only for the famous.

At the same time, the crown on the card does say something about ruling, for which prudence was especially associated. In Plato's Republic, which Visconti promoted as a model for his own state, prudence was the virtue in the state especially to be practiced by the rulers (well, technically wisdom, but prudence is just "wisdom for man" according to Aquinas). The crown on the card emphasizes ruling, but without itself meaning "prudence", even if ruling demands it. The same could be said for the Emperor and Pope, both rulers. There is also, for everyone, the Old Man with his lantern (or crutches and wings), cautioning us to use our time prudently. Or the Wheel of Fortune, cautioning us not to think that we don't need prudence to save us from her turns. Or the Hanged Man, warning us about political imprudence. And even for Plato it was also a virtue of the soul, which everyone has, one of its four virtues. So probably there was a Prudence card in the CY and decks before it, even if later it was removed (I think probably because the virtue could be inferred from so many other cards).

About halberds, I didn't think you thought that there was a special kind of art called "Medici art". It is just that I couldn't see any other way you could single out two works of art and explain one by the other and ignore other contexts of reference. Both of your examples are explainable in terms of the natural use of halberds and their use in previous art of its milieu. Let me add that the halberd helps to identify the man on top of the chariot as not just powerful, but as a man of the people. Halberds were used by foot soldiers against the cavalieri on horseback. As such, it seems more appropriate to Cosimo rather than il Magnifico, even if the most dramatic example of its use was its plebian use against Charles the Bold. And metaphorically it applies to more than just soldiers: it applies to anyone pitted against others or against a difficult subject (e.g. poetry), or even against his own "lower powers" (the Charioteer's horses). The Medici symbol on the chariot associates it with all that. As such it is appropriate any time after Cosimo's return from exile, as not only a power to be reckoned with but as someone who even though of the people was worthy of being followed.

Re: What are the documents for Marziano's dates?

#107
Ross G. R. Caldwell wrote:
28 Nov 2019, 17:30
Thank you very much, Alain! I had missed all of this from the Comptes of King René the first time around, in 2016.

I've been reading all of the original stuff you had posted then, and now. Thank you for posting a picture of the original entry, number 565. It is a shame that D'Agnel is not available online, I'd like to read all of the accounts, especially if there is any indication that he took over Isabelle's possessions after her death in February, 1453. I believe that he did, but there might be something in the comptes that is direct evidence.

For my point about René's interest in cards, it is not that I don't think he could have played cards, I imagined that he did, but I just had no evidence for it, so I had no basis to speculate. 1479 is only one year before he died, so it is a late example. But it is something.

It is not earth-shaking to know if René got the book (and cards?) or if Isabelle gave it to someone else, because it was already in the first catalogue of the library at Blois in 1518, and in all of the catalogues of the Royal library from that time forward until today. It is only to wonder what happened to it after 1453, which might shed light on where the cards went.
Hi Ross
I ve been away....
Thank you for yur answer.
If I find some time, I ll have a look at René's Comptes by D'Agnel for if there is any indication that he took over Isabelle's possessions after her death in February, 1453. ..



Aparte probably off topic

Jacques de Pazzi
Lord of Aubignan
Viguier de Marseille
Image

Inquiring about the Crescent Order and René, and following Cossa's life in Provence, I discovered that very probably the Chief of the Pazzi's Conspiration Jacoppo PAZZI and Jacques de PAZZI , member of the crescent Order and a right hand man of René, would refer to the same person.


Was Jacques de Pazzi, Consul of Avignon 1452 and 1458, member of Crescent Order of King René, the chief of the Pazzi conspiration against the Medicis ?

Jacoppo di Pazzi was also said to be in Florence a "gambler" ...no prEcision about cards just gambling...


Jacques de Pazzi
Seigneur d'Aubignol et Loriol
Lord of Aubignan
http://wappenwiki.org/index.php/Chevaliers_du_Croissant
He was also :
Banquier,(1450?) Syndic et Consul d'Avignon (1452 and 1458)
Viguier de Marseille
Maître d' Hôtel de René d'Anjou
Chevalier de l' Ordre du Croissant

Answering my suggestion, Huck had answered :
Alain : Could Jacques de PAZZI and Jacoppo PAZZI refer to the same person?
Huck : Of course, that's the same man.
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=691&hilit=pazzi+av ... 180#p18247
((Many posts about this befoer and after this one)

Jacques de Pazzi had a political function in Marseille in 1459, 1462 and 1464, and he likely was back after this time in Florence. Possibly a Pazzi bank still existed in Avignon in 1476? As pope Sixtus cooperated with the Pazzi bank?
Jacopo Pazzi was already rather old in 1478, 57 years.


What's your opinion?
http://www.sgdl-auteurs.org/alain-bouge ... Biographie

Re: What are the documents for Marziano's dates?

#108
About King René as a humanist ...
He and Marcello shared the same passion : "tous deux bibliophiles et passionnés de culture antique."
Jacopo Antonio Marcello was non only a friend but an admirer of King René to whom he offered precious gifts

About gifts he offered : " a stream of orned manuscripts treasures during at least a decade"
https://books.google.fr/books?id=RdWeII ... ne&f=false
"Dès cette période [1448?], le général vénitien fait parvenir des ouvrages à René d'Anjou et à sa femme Isabelle de Lorraine": was the 1449 gift the only one for Isabelle de Lorraine?
Aniwhere, ragarding René, he will offer the beautiful Strabon manuscript on September 13 1459

Jacopo Antonio Marcello remet le manuscrit à René d’Anjou
02_08b.jpg
02_08b.jpg (41.17 KiB) Viewed 255 times
Giovanni Bellini (Venise, vers 1430 - Venise, 1516)
Détrempe sur parchemin; H. : 37 cm ; L. : 25 cm
Albi, Médiathèque municipale Pierre - Amalric, RES.MS 77 : folio 4 © Médiathèque et bibliothèques municipales, Albi

Guarino de Vérone remet sa traduction de Strabon à Jacopo Antonio Marcello 13 juillet 1458
02_08a.jpg
02_08a.jpg (42.03 KiB) Viewed 261 times
Détrempe sur parchemin; H. : 37 cm ; L. : 25 cm
Albi, Médiathèque municipale Pierre - Amalric, RES.MS 77 : folio 3v° © Médiathèque et bibliothèques municipales, Albi

Traduit du grec ancien en latin par Guarino de Vérone sur commande du général vénitien Jacopo Antonio Marcello, ce texte de Strabon a été offert à René d'Anjou, comme cadeau diplomatique le 13 septembre 1459. Il fait partie d'un ensemble de livres envoyés par le militaire italien au prince français, tous deux bibliophiles et passionnés de culture antique.
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_situ_orbis_d%27Albi

I noted also in 1457 the Geography of Plolemee
King René receives these two gifts in 1457 and 1459 from his venetian friend Jacopo Antonio Marcello - the same who sent as gifts for his wife Isabelle de Lorraine via Jean COSSA, Sénéchal de Provence, either in his Provence castle of Tarascon or in his wife's castle of Saumur in Anjou, the "proto-tarots" in november 1449...


"De situ orbis conservé à la bibliothèque d'Albi (Ms. 77) est un manuscrit enluminé de la Géographie de Strabon, d'origine italienne, daté de 1459.
Traduit du grec ancien en latin par Guarino de Vérone sur commande du général vénitien Jacopo Antonio Marcello, ce texte de Strabon a été offert à René d'Anjou, comme cadeau diplomatique le 13 septembre 1459. Il fait partie d'un ensemble de livres envoyés par le militaire italien au prince français, tous deux bibliophiles et passionnés de culture antique.
Guarino de Vérone (1370-1460), un humaniste italien installé alors à Ferrare, réalise, à la demande du pape Nicolas V, la traduction de la Géographie de l'auteur grec antique Strabon en latin. C'est ce qu'indique la dédicace du présent manuscrit. En réalité, le pape fait appel conjointement à un autre traducteur, le romain Gregorio Tifernate qui doit travailler sur la seconde partie de l'ouvrage. Cependant, la mort du pape en 1455 interrompt leurs travaux. Le militaire et sénateur vénitien Jacopo Antonio Marcello (1399-1464) commande au seul Guarino l'achèvement de cette traduction. Ce dernier traduit alors la totalité de l'ouvrage, y compris la partie auparavant dévolue à Tifernate.
Marcello reçoit son manuscrit parachevé le 13 juillet 1458.
Marcello fait faire aussitôt deux copies dont l'une de prestige de ce texte, qui constitue le manuscrit d'Albi, entre 1458 et 1459. Une fois la copie achevée et enluminée, elle est offerte à René d'Anjou, roi de Naples comme l'atteste la dédicace datée du 13 septembre 1459

Le manuscrit d'Albi appartient à un ensemble de livres précieux échangés entre le général vénitien et le prince français. La République de Venise, dont le général est l'un des représentants, a en effet soutenu un temps les prétentions de René d'Anjou à la tête du royaume de Naples. René d'Anjou s'est battu contre Alphonse V d'Aragon pour conquérir le royaume napolitain, la dernière reine Jeanne II de Naples, sans enfant, ayant désigné, l'un après l'autre, les deux princes à sa succession par testament. René d'Anjou combat entre 1438 et 1442 le roi d'Aragon en Italie mais sans succès. En remerciement de son soutien, Marcello est admis au sein de l'ordre de chevalerie du Croissant, créé par René en 1448, en même temps que Francesco Sforza, qui a lui aussi soutenu le prince français.
Dès cette période [1448?], le général vénitien fait parvenir des ouvrages à René d'Anjou et à sa femme Isabelle de Lorraine. Une véritable amitié intellectuelle se crée ainsi, fondée sur un même goût pour les livres et les auteurs antiques. Une dizaine d'envois d'ouvrages sont recensés au total, tous identifiés grâce à la dédicace présente au début des manuscrits.
Par un retournement d'alliance, Venise se retrouve finalement allié à Alphonse V d'Aragon, le concurrent et vainqueur de René à Naples, contre les Sforza, arrivés au pouvoir à Milan en 1450. Marcello souhaite maintenir l'alliance avec les Français et conserver de bonnes relations avec René d'Anjou. Il lui fait alors parvenir, en 1453, une Passion de saint Maurice et de ses compagnons, saint protecteur de l'ordre du Croissant, dont une partie des miniatures est déjà attribuée à Giovanni Bellini ou à son père Jacopoms .

Giovanni Bellini (Venise, vers 1430 - Venise, 1516)
L’Assemblée du chapitre de l’ordre du Croissant 1453
Tempera sur parchemin; H. : 18,7 cm ; L. : 14 cm
Paris, Bibliothèque de l'Arsenal (BN), Ms 940, fol. CV © BnF
02_07.jpg
02_07.jpg (46.64 KiB) Viewed 258 times

circa 1453
Un miniaturiste lombard anonyme
Jacopo Bellini ou Giovanni Bellini (attribué à)
Saint Maurice, miniature extraite de la Passion de saint Maurice et de ses compagnons de Jacopo Antonio Marcello
390px-Passion_de_saint_Maurice_-_Arsenal940_-_saint_Maurice_f34v.jpg
390px-Passion_de_saint_Maurice_-_Arsenal940_-_saint_Maurice_f34v.jpg (73.33 KiB) Viewed 258 times
Le militaire vénitien, devenu gouverneur de Padoue peu après, adresse au prince angevin le 1er mars 1457 un autre ouvrage enluminé : une traduction en latin de la Géographie (Cosmographia) de Claude Ptolémée , accompagnée d'une mappemonde, d'une sphère, ainsi que de descriptions et cartes de la Terre sainte. Cet ouvrage est produit par un copiste et un enlumineur de la ville. De situ orbis semble être le dernier manuscrit de cette série d'échanges diplomatiques, interrompue par la mort du fils de Marcello et son départ pour Udine en 1461"


Nota
Interesting unicorn research the relation between Bellini and Mantegna
Andrea Mantegna et Giovanni Bellini
http://mini-site.louvre.fr/mantegna/acc ... n_2_5.html

"En 1453, Mantegna épouse Nicolosia, la soeur de Giovanni Bellini, et noue ainsi des rapports étroits avec le plus grand atelier de peinture à Venise, que dirige son beau-père Jacopo. Les échanges intenses d’idées entre les deux beaux-frères et le jeu d’influences qui en résulte auront des répercussions fondamentales sur les destinées de la peinture en Italie.

Des personnages qui composent le Polyptyque de saint Luc, entrepris par Mantegna en 1453, c’est la Sainte Justine qui se ressent le plus de la veine tendre de Giovanni Bellini, comme la Vierge et l’Enfant entourés de deux saints que son style incite à placer dans ces mêmes années.

Si Jacopo demeure fidèle dans ses paysages visionnaires au monde du gothique finissant, Giovanni se montre très tôt réceptif à l’art de Donatello, par exemple dans la prédelle relatant des épisodes de la vie de Drusienne. Les miniatures de la Passion de saint Maurice et de la Géographie de Strabon comme la Madone de Pavie trahissent également l’ascendant de Mantegna mais celui-ci sera de courte durée. Dès 1460, avec l’émouvant Christ bénissant qui, par sa matière brillante et son inspiration pathétique, atteste la séduction exercée par les maîtres flamands, notamment Rogier van der Weyden, Giovanni est en possession d’un style personnel."
http://www.sgdl-auteurs.org/alain-bouge ... Biographie

Re: What are the documents for Marziano's dates?

#109
hi Alain,
Recently I've read, that Rene became close to the Pazzi family, when he was in Florence after 4th of July 1442. For October 1442 I've read, that Rene was back in Provence.
For Alfonso and Naples I get ... "The siege began on 10 November 1441, ending on 2 June the following year. After the return of René to Provence, Alfonso easily reduced the remaining resistance and made his triumphal entrance in Naples on 26 February 1443, as the monarch of a pacified kingdom."

What happened to Rene between 2nd of June and 4th of July I don't know.

So the Pazzi-Rene connection was rather old.

The relation between Rene and Marcello was troubled by the war of 1453. Rene and Sforza fought against Venice and Marcello. In this situation Marcello shall have send his Mauritius manuscript.

In a letter of 24th of February 1449 Sforza introduced Marcello to Rene. I personally think, that this letter caused Scipio Caraffa (as a French diplomat) to appear in the camp of Marcello. There and then was opportunity, that Scipio saw the cheap Trionfi deck and had the idea, that Isabella would be enjoyed about it. Considering, that the letter from Sforza needed some time and Scipio as a French agent also needed time it might have been late March or early April 1449.

Meanwhile the Venetian army and Sforza had problems with Savoy. It is said, that the widow of Filippo Maria Visconti had arranged the Savoy engagement in favor of the Ambrosian republic. Two battles took place in April, which were won by the Venetian army and by Colleoni ... and lost by Savoy. So Savoy took up up peace negotiations. Things developed in the manner, that the interest of Sforza to get the rulership in Milan didn't develop, but the peace was arranged. Milan had a triumphal party in November (?) and also in November Marcello wrote his letter. Marcello had meanwhile gotten a title from Rene d'Anjou. Sforza pretended, that he had agreed with the peace. But around Cristmas Sforza made a surprising attack on Milan. In 2 months Sforza was successful (end February).

Italy had plans for the Jubilee year 1450. So the general political aim of the time was to have peace in Northern Italy. One of the peace preparations was, that Anti-Pope Felix V (a man from Savoy, the father of Filippo Maria's wife, duke Amadeus VIII) gave up his approach (7th of April 1449) and was satisfied with a cardinal title after long negotiations with Nicolas, the Italian pope.
Interesting Felix as Amadeus VIII had retired 1434 together with 6 knights to Ripaille and had founded a "Moritzorden" (= order of Mauritius), somehow that, what in 1449 was also founded by Rene d'Anjou. In 1439 then the council of Basel declared, that pope Eugen shouldn't be longer pope (June 25) and wished to have Amadeus as a new pope. So a delegation appeared in Ripaille at 15 December in 1439.
But Amadeus wished to keep his beard and from 17th December till Christmas 1439 he is a pope with beard ...
(so tells the webpage https://curiositas-mittelalter.blogspot ... lix-v.html )
... although there was a tradition, that popes shouldn't have a beard. Then Felix agreed with a personal beardless state. Well ... this pope has a beard and one wonders, why ...
Image
The picture doesn't come, it's the PMB-pope, we know it all

Felix V. died as a cardinal at 7 January, 1451.

This webpage tells ...
Er (Rene d'Anjou) bewegte 1449 den Gegen-Papst Felix V. zum Rücktritt, womit das letzte Papstschisma endete.
http://www.manfred-hiebl.de/genealogie- ... _1480.html
.... that Rene d'Anjou influenced Felix to give up his pope title, ending the last Schisma.

I don't find much to this point, a council of Lausanne in April 1449 seems to be the deciding place in these matters and Rene might indeed have influenced there something.
Huck
http://trionfi.com

Re: What are the documents for Marziano's dates?

#110
The Death of the Child Valerio Marcello (p. 110)
von Margaret L. King
https://books.google.de/books?id=RdWeII ... ng&f=false

The date of the letter of Sforza to Rene is given (24 February 1449).
The date of the foundation of the order of the Crescent is given (11 August 1448), short before the debacle of Caravaggio (Sforza'big s victory against troops of Venice, 15 September 1448). After this it came to a treaty between Sforza and Venice. Venice promised to help Sforza to gain Milan (18 October 1448). Sforza changed the side from Milan to the side of Venice.
In Milan the widow of Filippo Maria (daughter of Amadeus, the anti-pope Felix) to send a messenger to the Savoyan ruler, begging for help. 50.000 men were promised, but finally there were only 6000 (Klaus Schelle, Die Sforza, p. 107) . The fighting took place in April 1449, the final battle was in Borgomanero (22 April 1449) ...
https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battaglia_di_Borgomanero

In May 1449 then started peace negotiations between Savoy and Venice. Later also Milan participated (August/September).

26 August 1449: Marcello and Sforza were added as members 17th and 18th of the order of the Crescent.

Peace was declared between Milan and Venice. 24 September 1449
Mentre l'esercito stava fuori Porta Orientale e Porta Nuova, i veneziani firmano a Brescia la pace con la Repubblica. Bartolomeo Colleoni con le truppe veneziane si ritira. Milano avrebbe avuto Como, Lodi e la Brianza, lo Sforza le città del Piemonte, Pavia, Piacenza, Parma e Cremona. Francesco Sforza prende tempo e mantiene le sue truppe sull'Adda per impedire ai Veneziani di rifornire Milano di viveri.
(StoriadiMilano http://www.storiadimilano.it/cron/dal1426al1450.htm )
While the army was outside Porta Orientale and Porta Nuova, the Venetians signed peace in Brescia with the Republic. Bartolomeo Colleoni with the Venetian troops retires. Milan would have Como, Lodi and Brianza, Sforza the cities of Piedmont, Pavia, Piacenza, Parma and Cremona. Francesco Sforza takes his time and maintains his troops on the Adda to prevent the Venetians from supplying Milan with food.
Then there should have been a break of the good relations between Sforza and Marcello.

12 October 1449
Grande spettacolo in piazza dell'Arengo per celebrare la pace con Venezia. Due personaggi che rappresentano san Marco e sant'Ambrogio si abbracciano e così fanno tutti gli altri membri delle due repubbliche. (storiadimilano)
Great show in piazza dell'Arengo to celebrate peace with Venice. Two characters representing Saint Mark and Saint Ambrose embrace each other and so do all the other members of the two republics
This should have been a sort of Trionfi festivity in Milan.

9 December 1449
2 Silkdealers of Florence (Lorenzo di Bartolo and Matteo di Zanobi) acquire 6 Trionfi decks for sale from Giovanni di Domenico (playing card producer). This is the first appearance of Trionfi decks in the Florentine lists since 23 January 1445.
It's a good question, if this Trionfi production was in some way inspired by the peace celebrations in Milan in October 1449.
In the context of the letter of Francesco Sforza (24 February 1449) King notes: "The condottiere (Sforza) hinted at the possibility of Venetian support for his plan (Rene) to retake Naples; plausibly, since at this very time the Florentine humanist and diplomat Giannozzo Manetti was in Venice, working with his unique skill and eloquence for a French alliance." Just Manetti, who is known as playing card foe at other opportunities (in Pistoia).

Added: I found this, which seems to state, that Manetti was a longer time in Venice.
https://digi.ub.uni-heidelberg.de/digli ... al_lat_931
It could be interesting, if Manetti had contact to Marcello.

King, Valerio, page 269
https://books.google.de/books?id=RdWeII ... o"&f=false
Manetti is given as Florentine representative in Venice for 1448-49. "Giannozzo Manetti is Florence's representative in Venice, urging Venice to support Rene d'Anjou in displacing Alfonso in Naples."

page 194: King compares Marcello's work to the death of Valerio to a work of Manetti in 1438/39. Possibly Marcello was inspired by the work of Manetti?
Huck
http://trionfi.com

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