SteveM wrote: But as you note there are 122 dialogues in book one, not 121; straightaway you are reduced to 'fixing' the figures to suit your perceived scheme.

However, Petrarch did use number symbolism, and was very much influenced by Augustine's use of such (of which we have already given an example in the division of the City of God (one of the books it is said for Petrarch to possess) into 22 books) :

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=DmG1 ... sm&f=false

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=IIVU ... q=&f=false

[/quote]

Petrarca had two books, he couldn't have arranged a 3rd for the short introduction (in the case, it was in his intention the first chapter of book Nr. 1, which governs this part), or for a combining chapter in the middle of the book (in this case it would be chapter 122, book 1) . Here are the titles:

Book 1, chapter 1 : De aetate florida
Book 1, chapter 122: De spe vita aeternae

Both titles might fulfill the "specific function", it eben might be thought, that 1 plus 122 are regarded by the author as one chapter (begin and end of book 1 - book 1 is the better part of life).

Interesting is the feature, that spes enters as speaker after chapter 108, having 14 chapters still to do ... the negative book 2 ends with the meta chapter death, and this meta chapter also has 14 chapters.

Your information about Augustine is interesting ... as I take from the decription at ...
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/1201.htm
.., Augustine had in chapter Nr. 13 a reference to death (as it is also Tarot):

Book 13 In this book it is taught that death is penal, and had its origin in Adam's sin.

Some other chapters might be also "somehow Tarot-related" ... he seems to have a basic partition 1-10 and 11-22 (book1 and book 2), and the web page tells in chapter 11 the mystery of it with ..

Here begins the second part of this work, which treats of the origin, history, and destinies of the two cities, the earthly and the heavenly. In the first place, Augustine shows in this book how the two cities were formed originally, by the separation of the good and bad angels; and takes occasion to treat of the creation of the world, as it is described in Holy Scripture in the beginning of the book of Genesis.

... looking through the further description, we find in chapter 20 ...

Book 20 Concerning the last judgment, and the declarations regarding it in the old and new testaments. [Last judgment, as in Tarot]

... in 21 the city of the devil ...

Book 21 Of the end reserved for the city of the devil, namely, the eternal punishment of the damned; and of the arguments which unbelief brings against it.

.. and in 22 the city of god

Book 22 This book treats of the end of the city of God, that is to say, of the eternal happiness of the saints; the faith of the resurrection of the body is established and explained; and the work concludes by showing how the saints, clothed in immortal and spiritual bodies, shall be employed.

So maybe it's a chapter ordering like ...

1-10 (...)
11-20 about the both cities
21 about the city of devil
22 about the city of god

... whereby the explanation of the web page indicates this sorting:

Book 15 Having treated in the four preceding books of the origin of the two cities, the earthly and the heavenly, Augustine explains their growth and progress in the four books which follow; and, in order to do so, he explains the chief passages of the sacred history which bear upon this subject. In this fifteenth book he opens this part of his work by explaining the events recorded in Genesis from the time of Cain and Abel to the deluge.

1-10 (...)
11-14 (... origin of cities)
(15 ... sacred history)
16-19 (... )
20 Last judgment
21 city of devil
22 city of god.

It's not obvious to me, which structure the first 10 are following.

Very interesting this sumary of 22 in christian tradition. Thanks, Steve.

+++

De remediis in italian:

http://books.google.es/books?id=Hgo6AAA ... &q&f=false

The cards in De remediis...

In latin:

27
DE LUDO TAXILLORUM PROSPERO
G. -- Iuvat ad taxillos ludere.
R. -- O vorago ingens inexplebilis, o patrimoniorum fluxus tristis ac subitus, o animi tempestas et fame nubes et scelerum stimulus et ad desperandum via! Superiores utcumque ludi sunt, hic merus est dolor.
G. -- At michi prosper ludi huius eventus fuit.
R. -- Taxillorum nullus eventus prosper, mali omnes et miseri; nam et qui perdit affligitur et qui vincit illicitur inque insidias protrahitur.
G. -- Prospere lusi.
R. -- Presens sepe prosperitas future calamitatis auspicium fuit et suas habet hec pestis illecebras: si qui talis ludunt omnes perderent, nemo umquam luderet. Nunc lucrantur aliqui, sed lucrum illud arra est damni.
G. -- Lusi et vici.
R. -- Bene, nisi in campum redis: alioquin nullus campus planior, nullo in campo volubilior est fortuna.
G. -- Lusi et vici.
R. -- Ludes iterum et perdes. Quod vicisti autem hinc atque illinc mille diripient, quod perdideris nemo restituet. Adde quod, si quid est iustitie, quod vincis non fit tuum; at quod perdis, etsi non fiat alterius, tuum tamen esse desinit. Multa sunt undique que ab hac insania bonam mentem dehortentur ac retrahant, nisi vos impetus quidam avaritia pulsus urgeret.
G. -- Vici in ludo taxillorum.
R. -- Scito autem te ab exactore impio fenus centesimum accepisse: restitues quod vicisti et de tuo adicies; ut non sit qui repetat, per se ipsum evanuerit tuque in somnis felix esse desieris.
G. -- Vici et ditior factus sum.
R. -- Cum nulla sit stabilis pecunia sed sua potius rotunditate versatilis, tum precipue que taxillis queritur. Taxillorum ludus nichil ulli donat, eorum maxime qui familiarius illum colunt, sed mutuat aliquid et extorquet, eo semper immitior quo blandior visus erat. Nulla enim amarior est iactura quam lucri dulcedinem degustare orso.
G. -- Lusi et lucratus sum.
R. -- Gaudere lucro taxillorum tale est ac si dulci gaudeas veneno: utrumque mox per venas erumpet.
G. -- Ludo prospero delectatus sum.
R. -- Peior est delectatio peccati quam peccatum ipsum: sunt qui mala consuetudine pene coacti peccant neque post peccatum gaudent sed tristantur; si fieri possit, non peccasse maluerint. Quosdam vidimus inter ipsas libidinum flammas quandam velut glaciem doloris ac penitentie sentire et, si dici liceat, velle simul ac nolle, peiorem licet in partem mali usus quadam vi detorsos, quos haud improbe quis speret usu excusso ad meliorem semitam posse converti: at qui de peccato exultant, quid de his, oro, reliquum spei est?
G. -- Delector taxillorum ludo.
R. -- Spero fore ne semper neu diu etiam delecteris; volvitur assidue fundatarum status urbium: tu stabiles taxillos putas! Crede michi, volventur et secum in lacrimas gaudium tuum volvent. Neque enim sic volventur ut vidisti: tunc inane tibi gaudium, nunc veros gemitus parabunt.
G. -- Delectat ludere.
R. -- Delectatio funesta et turpis corruptique animi! Ira enim et convicio dignus es. Nam quis, queso, ingenuus, seu quis homo et non potius trux belua delectari queat ludi nomen habente nequitia atque impietate fedissima? Ubi preter hominum vultus nichil humanum sit vultusque ipsi, iracundia ac merore obsiti confusisque clamoribus efferati, nec iam sint humani, ubi non decor morum, non modestia sit verborum, non amor erga homines, non erga Deum reverentia, sed iurgia et rancores et doli et periuria et rapine, vulnera ad extremum et homicidia quoque? Nil in Deum sevius potest humana temeritas, divini nominis blasphemie, quibus ante omnes scelerum officinas ille ludus infelix scatet: ubi si quos forte tacitos pudor tenet, crebro tamen suspectantes, quid labiis cordis agant sciunt ipsi. Quis hunc ludum verus homo, non dicam tractare manibus, sed spectare oculis possit et non angi prorsus fugarique scelesti spectaculi feditate?
G. -- Delector tamen hoc ludo.
R. -- Vide ne Cretensium imprecatio in tuum caput inciderit, mala consuetudine delectari, quo nichil dictu levius, nichil eventu gravius propiusque exitio est.
G. -- Delector taxillorum ludo.
R. -- Abicienda est delectatio inhonesta, etsi non virtutis, at saltem fame studio et pudoris cura. Nam vix aliud in actibus hominum invenias ubi tam clare mores ac vitia detegantur: vidisti alacriter in prelium descensuros in hoc ludo tremere atque orare flebiliter et suum numerum invocare, quosdam alibi magnanimos ac tranquillos illic pro parva pecunia et precari et irasci et in finem furere. Quam multa pro paucis nummis sepe ibi fecerunt viri fortes, que pro ingenti thesauro alibi non fecissent! Ibi enim vitiorum omnium sed in primis ire atque avaritie regnum est. Meministi ut Naso — in eo libro quo inhonestam quidem ac supervacuam artem docet, utile tamen interdum aliquid interserit — amatrices monet, ut ob animi vitia celanda ludo hoc aut simili abstineant, ne conspecte ira tumide aut avaritia exhauste amatoribus displiceant suis. Quanto id viris dignius precipitur, ne non modo hominum sed Dei oculos omnia videntis et bonos animos moresque ingenuos amantis offendant!
G. -- Lusi, vici, gaudeo.
R. -- Ludus turpis, damnosa victoria, gaudium inane!
G. -- Vici, gaudeo.
R. -- Omne de suo malo gaudium stultum est. Proinde tartareus quispiam ludi huius inventor fuit, cuius inscii ludibrio ac noxe, scientes vero miraculo subiaceant ac stupori. Nam quid mirabilius quam quod veteri proverbio vulgatum verumque iugi experientia deprehenditur, omnes huiusce ludi magistros nudos esse atque inopes et egenos?

http://ilpetrarca.interfree.it/petrarca ... tunae.html

The strange is...

Remigio Fiorentino traslate "LUDO TAXILLORUM" as "game of cards".

http://books.google.es/books?id=Hgo6AAA ... &q&f=false

But other fonts traslate "LUDO TAXILLORUM" as dice...

I am confused whit this.

... ... Taxillorum are mostly seen as dice. This wouldn't go as "evidence".

Actually my question is ... why doesn't Petrarca speak of chess? Or did you see something about it?

Remigio Fiorentino (living mid 16th century, I think) likely didn't have much chance to know about the conditions 200 years ago.

Ok. Thanks, friend...

It is an interesting question. Perhaps because is not luck-random (in spanish, azar) game. I dont know where I read in the first times the chess had dices, and after they removed for not join the random (sin) ... I dont know, I'll finish the book (I still have a little over 700 pages and I'm a little drunk. I think today will not give me time to finish).

mmfilesi wrote:Ok. Thanks, friend...

It is an interesting question. Perhaps because is not luck-random (in spanish, azar) game. I dont know where I read in the first times the chess had dices, and after they removed for not join the random (sin) ... I dont know, I'll finish the book (I still have a little over 700 pages and I'm a little drunk. I think today will not give me time to finish).

Yes, chess was occasionally played with dice. For instance Alfonso the wise presents it as possibility, not as a major theme. I would assume, that chess had in the untold background a lot of variations also in Europe, bit likely these variants all were not mainstream.

Another variation on the four passions is also to be found in Platonic Theology by Marcilio Ficino:

Quote:

"In no way should we dismiss as merely poetical the oracle that Virgil gives us in the sixth book, where, following Mercurius in part and Plato in part, he describes four passions, which four are a consequence of the humors, since it seems appropriate that appetite is born from the fiery bile, pleasure from the airy blood, fear from the earthy black bile, and grief and weakness from the watery phlegm."

Vol. 6, Book XVIII, Chap. X.17, trans., Michael Allen.